1 00:01:03,020 --> 00:01:05,580 ♪ All we do is hide away 2 00:01:06,860 --> 00:01:10,136 ♪ All we do is, all we do is hide away 3 00:01:10,660 --> 00:01:13,458 ♪ All we do is lie and wait 4 00:01:14,460 --> 00:01:18,169 ♪ All we do is, all we do is lie and wait 5 00:01:18,260 --> 00:01:21,889 ♪ I've been upside down 6 00:01:21,980 --> 00:01:25,575 ♪ I don't wanna be the right way 'round 7 00:01:25,660 --> 00:01:29,369 ♪ Can't find paradise on the ground ♪ 8 00:01:42,380 --> 00:01:46,771 So... What did he tell you? My dad? 9 00:01:48,540 --> 00:01:50,929 Enough for me to know if you 10 00:01:51,020 --> 00:01:53,295 never want to talk about this again, then that's fine. 11 00:01:55,660 --> 00:01:59,130 Or if you want to talk about it every day 12 00:02:00,100 --> 00:02:02,978 for the rest of your life, that's fine, too. 13 00:02:10,100 --> 00:02:12,330 - I'm doing it properly. - I see you are. 14 00:02:22,380 --> 00:02:25,133 He was just very shocked when I introduced myself, 15 00:02:25,940 --> 00:02:27,293 and scared. 16 00:02:28,780 --> 00:02:30,975 And he was babbling 17 00:02:31,060 --> 00:02:34,689 and kept repeating that it, didn't mean anything. 18 00:02:36,420 --> 00:02:38,411 He kept on apologising, 19 00:02:38,900 --> 00:02:42,415 but I wasn't interested in apologies. I didn't want contrition. 20 00:02:42,660 --> 00:02:44,457 What I wanted was... 21 00:02:45,940 --> 00:02:47,817 To understand. 22 00:02:50,140 --> 00:02:52,700 And the only person who could help me do that 23 00:02:54,740 --> 00:02:56,093 was dead. 24 00:03:31,020 --> 00:03:34,933 Does it ever cross your mind, Cass, we have a very limited pot of money 25 00:03:35,980 --> 00:03:38,619 and if we spend too much on an incredibly expensive 26 00:03:38,700 --> 00:03:41,692 and time consuming investigation in to 40-year-old abuse, 27 00:03:42,060 --> 00:03:45,450 then we've got nothing to spend on a child that got abused last week. 28 00:03:47,300 --> 00:03:48,574 Yes, of course. 29 00:03:53,380 --> 00:03:54,529 And? 30 00:04:01,140 --> 00:04:02,459 Would you like to come through? 31 00:04:03,060 --> 00:04:06,097 And in terms of the bigger investigation, 32 00:04:06,180 --> 00:04:08,535 the murder investigation, where are you with that? 33 00:04:08,820 --> 00:04:09,969 I don't know. 34 00:04:10,980 --> 00:04:14,256 They questioned me again yesterday, but I have a watertight alibi. 35 00:04:14,340 --> 00:04:16,570 And this was that you were sectioned in the Maudsley. 36 00:04:18,260 --> 00:04:20,091 Twenty-six years ago, yes. 37 00:04:20,780 --> 00:04:23,817 And for what it's worth, I did not kill David Walker. 38 00:04:25,740 --> 00:04:26,934 Okay. 39 00:04:28,060 --> 00:04:30,130 I just hope I have all the facts now. 40 00:04:30,220 --> 00:04:33,257 I just need to, er, consider how best to proceed. 41 00:04:33,340 --> 00:04:34,409 Yeah, of course. 42 00:04:34,580 --> 00:04:36,298 - How long do you think it will be... - I don't know. 43 00:04:36,380 --> 00:04:38,735 I've never had to deal with anything remotely like this. 44 00:04:38,820 --> 00:04:42,733 I'm sorry for snapping, but I'm... I'm cross. And disappointed. 45 00:04:43,500 --> 00:04:44,774 And Flo? 46 00:04:47,300 --> 00:04:49,860 Erm, Simon, could you could pick her up from school today? 47 00:04:49,940 --> 00:04:53,091 - Yeah. - Okay, thank you and, Colin, 48 00:04:53,940 --> 00:04:58,252 until I decide what to do, I need you to find somewhere else to stay, please. 49 00:04:58,940 --> 00:05:00,214 Sure. Sure. 50 00:05:00,460 --> 00:05:05,659 And if the investigation goes away then maybe, we can get through this. 51 00:05:06,140 --> 00:05:11,260 If it drags on, if, God forbid, you were charged and it went to trial, 52 00:05:12,220 --> 00:05:14,131 we could obviously never let you parent Flo. 53 00:05:14,220 --> 00:05:17,178 You'd either have to move out permanently, 54 00:05:18,260 --> 00:05:20,535 and we'd have to consider Simon as a single parent, 55 00:05:20,620 --> 00:05:22,531 or if you both felt you couldn't do that, 56 00:05:23,460 --> 00:05:25,018 then we'd have to take her back. 57 00:05:27,260 --> 00:05:30,570 You know I would actually get the boys DNA tested 58 00:05:30,660 --> 00:05:32,173 if I thought it would help you. 59 00:05:32,260 --> 00:05:34,410 But I know you know it's nonsense. 60 00:05:34,820 --> 00:05:37,254 You just wanted him gone. 61 00:05:38,020 --> 00:05:39,499 Like me and Mum. 62 00:05:40,100 --> 00:05:43,809 So that he couldn't ask you any more questions you didn't want to answer. 63 00:05:44,180 --> 00:05:47,092 But Mum and I are not going anywhere. 64 00:05:48,020 --> 00:05:49,248 I'm sorry. 65 00:05:51,900 --> 00:05:54,368 Anyway, come on, do you want another cup of tea? 66 00:06:03,180 --> 00:06:07,492 So for over two weeks now, we've all wrestled with this case. 67 00:06:08,540 --> 00:06:12,419 Following one dead end after another, 68 00:06:12,500 --> 00:06:14,809 with the final nail in the coffin of the idea 69 00:06:14,900 --> 00:06:18,290 of Sara Mahmoud's possible guilt, coming last night, 70 00:06:19,380 --> 00:06:23,214 when her husband turned up out of the blue, with this. 71 00:06:25,220 --> 00:06:28,098 Evidence she was in Italy at the time of Walker's death. 72 00:06:28,180 --> 00:06:30,455 Which, er, was a blow. 73 00:06:30,540 --> 00:06:35,409 Because we know that Sara knew Walker, and I reckon if we hunted hard enough, 74 00:06:35,780 --> 00:06:40,251 we could conclusively place her at a gathering Walker was at. 75 00:06:40,340 --> 00:06:43,093 Given also we know what Walker liked to do to young girls, 76 00:06:43,180 --> 00:06:47,139 when he turns up at her flat, as a client, eight years later, 77 00:06:47,220 --> 00:06:50,337 she has the perfect motive for a revenge murder. 78 00:06:50,420 --> 00:06:52,809 - Except the alibi is good. - More than good. 79 00:06:53,940 --> 00:06:57,012 It's watertight. There's no way she could have killed him. 80 00:06:58,420 --> 00:06:59,569 Question is, 81 00:07:01,020 --> 00:07:02,373 is it too good? 82 00:07:03,500 --> 00:07:05,138 - You think it's faked somehow? - No. 83 00:07:06,580 --> 00:07:10,255 I think it's real, but what it feels like to me is, 84 00:07:10,340 --> 00:07:13,730 is a bunch of information collected by a woman 85 00:07:13,820 --> 00:07:15,572 who knew she'd need an alibi. 86 00:07:16,140 --> 00:07:17,459 Which would mean, 87 00:07:18,660 --> 00:07:22,255 she'd have had to know that Walker was going to die? 88 00:07:23,100 --> 00:07:24,215 Yes. 89 00:07:26,460 --> 00:07:29,099 Okay, here goes, and, erm, 90 00:07:31,460 --> 00:07:33,815 stop me when it gets too mental. 91 00:07:35,020 --> 00:07:37,693 So, we have three suspects 92 00:07:37,780 --> 00:07:42,490 who actually all have dysfunction consistent with abusive childhoods. 93 00:07:42,580 --> 00:07:46,129 Drink issues, mental-health issues, relationship issues. 94 00:07:47,180 --> 00:07:51,492 We have three people who, for my money, 95 00:07:51,580 --> 00:07:54,617 just tried too hard to look like they didn't know each other. 96 00:07:57,100 --> 00:07:58,852 And then we have an idea. 97 00:08:00,300 --> 00:08:03,019 That Sara Mahmoud was abused by David Walker, 98 00:08:04,180 --> 00:08:08,935 but that Colin and Marion were abused by people we've not yet identified. 99 00:08:10,500 --> 00:08:13,651 And that, at some point in early 1990, 100 00:08:13,740 --> 00:08:16,971 after Sara realises the client is the same man who'd raped her 101 00:08:17,060 --> 00:08:20,257 at a gathering eight years before, the three of them, 102 00:08:21,180 --> 00:08:23,819 already, I believe, known to each other, somehow, 103 00:08:24,580 --> 00:08:29,529 came together and hatched a plan to murder all three of their abusers. 104 00:08:30,060 --> 00:08:32,733 Now they knew if they murdered their own abuser, 105 00:08:32,820 --> 00:08:35,288 there'd almost certainly be an easily traceable link back to them. 106 00:08:38,460 --> 00:08:40,132 So they agreed to kill each other's. 107 00:08:43,740 --> 00:08:46,459 S-Sorry, Guv, if I'm being dim here, but, erm, 108 00:08:47,060 --> 00:08:49,290 if you've created the perfect alibi, 109 00:08:49,540 --> 00:08:52,134 why did Sara wait two weeks before she gave it to us? 110 00:08:52,220 --> 00:08:55,292 'Cause offering it up immediately could also arouse suspicion. 111 00:08:55,980 --> 00:08:58,699 How much more credible for her husband to find it? 112 00:08:58,780 --> 00:09:02,011 And you think Walker was the first victim? 113 00:09:02,100 --> 00:09:04,978 I think him turning up as a punter at Sara's flat 114 00:09:05,060 --> 00:09:06,334 was what kicked it all off. 115 00:09:06,420 --> 00:09:10,413 - And he was killed by? - Has to be Marion, doesn't it? 116 00:09:10,500 --> 00:09:11,569 I think so. 117 00:09:11,660 --> 00:09:14,413 Osborne was in the Maudsley, Sara was in Italy. 118 00:09:14,660 --> 00:09:17,015 And Walker's body was found less than eight miles 119 00:09:17,100 --> 00:09:18,977 from Marion's parents' house. 120 00:09:19,260 --> 00:09:22,138 So why did Osborne spend so much time with Walker, then? 121 00:09:22,220 --> 00:09:25,098 I think he was trying to confirm that Walker was who Sara thought he was. 122 00:09:25,180 --> 00:09:29,014 So then that has to mean that Sara would have had to kill 123 00:09:29,100 --> 00:09:31,694 Colin Osborne's abuser, and Osborne, Marion's? 124 00:09:33,060 --> 00:09:34,539 Yes. 125 00:09:35,340 --> 00:09:36,693 And if we're right, 126 00:09:38,660 --> 00:09:41,413 to prove this theory, we'd need to find three things. 127 00:09:41,500 --> 00:09:46,528 We'd need to find evidence of that historic connection, 128 00:09:47,860 --> 00:09:51,819 we'd need to find evidence of who those other abusers might have been. 129 00:09:55,220 --> 00:09:57,939 And we'd need to find two more bodies. 130 00:10:11,300 --> 00:10:13,097 It won't be forever. It's fine. 131 00:10:16,500 --> 00:10:18,252 Give her a big kiss from me. 132 00:10:21,500 --> 00:10:23,889 Tell her I love her and I'll be back very soon. 133 00:10:33,180 --> 00:10:37,810 Murray and Jake. We need to find out where our three suspects might have met, 134 00:10:37,980 --> 00:10:41,177 but we know that two of them weren't even in London till 1985. 135 00:10:42,060 --> 00:10:43,732 So we're looking at a meeting that happened 136 00:10:43,820 --> 00:10:46,050 sometime between then and 1990. 137 00:10:46,660 --> 00:10:50,175 Where might that have occurred? Was it through a job, 138 00:10:50,260 --> 00:10:53,616 a party, a flat-share, group counselling, I don't know. 139 00:10:53,700 --> 00:10:56,260 Think laterally. We will be focusing on the suspects' families. 140 00:10:56,340 --> 00:10:59,252 DCI Stuart will go to Glasgow to talk to Colin Osborne's father. 141 00:10:59,340 --> 00:11:02,810 Fran will visit Sara Mahmoud's husband. I will visit Marion Kelsey's sister. 142 00:11:03,300 --> 00:11:04,699 We don't think they'll know a lot about 143 00:11:04,780 --> 00:11:06,771 what's been going on the last few weeks, 144 00:11:07,580 --> 00:11:08,933 and if our suspects were abused, 145 00:11:09,020 --> 00:11:12,092 then their families are our most likely source of information. 146 00:11:12,460 --> 00:11:14,416 And how much do we actually tell them? 147 00:11:16,020 --> 00:11:17,658 We stop short of actually lying, 148 00:11:18,700 --> 00:11:20,611 but not by much, or we'll get nothing. 149 00:11:21,180 --> 00:11:23,011 We don't need these interviews to be admissible. 150 00:11:23,100 --> 00:11:25,375 Right now, we just need to know that we're on the right lines. 151 00:11:26,900 --> 00:11:29,858 So no appointments, no warnings we're coming. 152 00:11:30,940 --> 00:11:32,612 We need to catch them on the back foot. 153 00:11:53,700 --> 00:11:55,850 - You don't need to say anything. - Look. I... 154 00:11:57,580 --> 00:12:01,858 I just hope this doesn't affect our work. Or our friendship. 155 00:12:01,940 --> 00:12:04,295 It won't. It hasn't, all right? I promise. 156 00:12:07,700 --> 00:12:09,372 Now piss off. 157 00:12:41,180 --> 00:12:43,410 They're trying to trace more of the victims of the activities 158 00:12:43,500 --> 00:12:45,491 inside this Brentwood House and if they do, 159 00:12:45,580 --> 00:12:48,253 they think they could support the allegation you were present there 160 00:12:48,340 --> 00:12:49,773 on at least one occasion. 161 00:12:51,100 --> 00:12:52,852 You're gonna be suspended from all duties, 162 00:12:52,940 --> 00:12:54,817 whilst a full investigation takes place. 163 00:12:55,260 --> 00:12:56,818 I have to ask, 164 00:12:58,220 --> 00:13:00,097 if you did know what he was doing, 165 00:13:01,100 --> 00:13:03,091 how could you have not said anything? 166 00:13:09,180 --> 00:13:11,819 It sounds so inadequate, doesn't it? 167 00:13:13,060 --> 00:13:16,496 When you hear it on the news, people saying they were different times. 168 00:13:18,860 --> 00:13:19,975 But they were. 169 00:13:21,460 --> 00:13:25,499 There were times when a rock star could go on telly, 170 00:13:25,660 --> 00:13:29,699 being interviewed about his underage girlfriend and no one got arrested. 171 00:13:31,820 --> 00:13:35,096 We all just shrugged it off. 172 00:13:37,260 --> 00:13:41,412 Thought it was sort of cheeky and amusing. 173 00:13:42,140 --> 00:13:45,815 We all bought into that, until we didn't. 174 00:13:52,500 --> 00:13:54,331 So that time I followed him, 175 00:13:58,740 --> 00:14:00,253 and it was just once. 176 00:14:05,780 --> 00:14:07,691 He told me she was 16. 177 00:14:13,540 --> 00:14:14,768 And willing. 178 00:14:16,580 --> 00:14:18,298 And he begged me to forgive him. 179 00:14:20,500 --> 00:14:21,933 And I wanted to. 180 00:14:24,540 --> 00:14:28,692 Both forgive him and believe him. 181 00:14:30,820 --> 00:14:32,173 Because, otherwise, 182 00:14:33,460 --> 00:14:35,416 it was the end of our marriage 183 00:14:37,100 --> 00:14:38,818 and everything we'd built up together. 184 00:14:46,100 --> 00:14:47,328 And so I did. 185 00:14:51,940 --> 00:14:53,214 And for that, 186 00:14:57,620 --> 00:14:59,611 I am truly ashamed. 187 00:15:13,180 --> 00:15:17,458 Well, Colin was a, a lively lad, you know, when he was a little boy. 188 00:15:17,740 --> 00:15:20,049 He was full of mischief and fun. 189 00:15:20,860 --> 00:15:22,930 And then, when he was about... 190 00:15:25,260 --> 00:15:28,297 Nine, he just, 191 00:15:28,980 --> 00:15:31,255 slowly started to change. 192 00:15:31,340 --> 00:15:35,652 Became quieter, you know, more introverted. 193 00:15:35,740 --> 00:15:40,097 Staying in his room more and not seeing his pals so much, you know. 194 00:15:40,660 --> 00:15:44,573 And his, his school work suffered. 195 00:15:45,260 --> 00:15:47,216 And he stopped being affectionate. 196 00:15:47,820 --> 00:15:51,415 Got angry at the slightest thing and, er, he just, 197 00:15:53,940 --> 00:15:55,453 became a different child. 198 00:15:56,140 --> 00:15:59,132 And I presume you asked him what was wrong? 199 00:15:59,220 --> 00:16:00,972 Over and over, for years. 200 00:16:03,180 --> 00:16:06,377 - He would always just say "Nothing". - Say "I'm fine". 201 00:16:07,220 --> 00:16:10,496 So, in the end we just thought, well, that's how it is. That's... 202 00:16:10,580 --> 00:16:13,014 That's how he was, that, er... 203 00:16:14,700 --> 00:16:16,292 Children change. 204 00:16:17,900 --> 00:16:21,017 And what you're talking about, sexual abuse, 205 00:16:21,380 --> 00:16:24,656 wasn't something that you considered back in the '70s. 206 00:16:24,740 --> 00:16:29,495 It wasn't one of the options for why a child isn't themselves. 207 00:16:29,700 --> 00:16:33,056 But if we consider it as a possibility now, 208 00:16:34,940 --> 00:16:39,491 do you have any idea where something like that could have happened to Colin? 209 00:16:39,980 --> 00:16:42,574 Were there ever any issues in his primary school? 210 00:16:44,140 --> 00:16:45,255 No. 211 00:16:45,980 --> 00:16:47,698 I never heard nothing like that there. 212 00:16:47,780 --> 00:16:50,340 - Any friends or family? - No. 213 00:16:52,060 --> 00:16:54,096 Was he a member of a church, 214 00:16:56,380 --> 00:16:59,372 or a football team or a scout group or... 215 00:17:04,060 --> 00:17:05,129 Mr Osborne? 216 00:17:08,500 --> 00:17:12,812 There was one bloke, a pal from work, Len Paxton. 217 00:17:14,300 --> 00:17:17,053 He ran the local platoon of 218 00:17:18,460 --> 00:17:20,018 Club Rangers. 219 00:17:27,620 --> 00:17:32,057 I don't know why she seems to hate me. Or hate our mum. 220 00:17:32,740 --> 00:17:35,573 Like I said, she's troubled. 221 00:17:35,820 --> 00:17:38,254 - Was it always like that? - Absolutely not. No. 222 00:17:39,060 --> 00:17:40,971 We adored each other when we were growing up. 223 00:17:41,060 --> 00:17:44,177 Do you remember when it changed? Was it overnight or... 224 00:17:44,260 --> 00:17:46,854 No, I remember it exactly when it changed. 225 00:17:47,580 --> 00:17:53,849 I was 14 and Marion was 11, and we'd moved to Cork. 226 00:17:54,500 --> 00:17:56,809 Our dad had got a job as a lecturer there. 227 00:17:56,900 --> 00:17:59,972 You know we had a great house, a lovely garden. 228 00:18:00,060 --> 00:18:02,335 We even got our own rooms, for the first time. 229 00:18:04,260 --> 00:18:09,254 But Marion just seemed to hate it. Overnight, she became 230 00:18:10,100 --> 00:18:13,536 - distant, sullen, aggressive. - Towards you? 231 00:18:13,620 --> 00:18:16,737 Towards me, towards our mum, at school, everyone. 232 00:18:16,820 --> 00:18:18,173 Including your dad? 233 00:18:19,460 --> 00:18:22,293 Actually, no, not Dad. 234 00:18:23,460 --> 00:18:26,452 But then him and Marion were always stupidly close. 235 00:18:26,540 --> 00:18:30,658 So, no, Dad was the only one who escaped her ire. 236 00:18:30,900 --> 00:18:32,572 When did your dad pass away? 237 00:18:32,900 --> 00:18:34,538 Er, 1991. 238 00:18:34,980 --> 00:18:37,448 - How old was he? - 57. 239 00:18:39,780 --> 00:18:42,340 That sounds pretty young. Was he ill? 240 00:18:44,540 --> 00:18:47,179 - Why do you ask? - Just trying to fill in the gaps. 241 00:18:49,420 --> 00:18:52,139 Well, no, he wasn't ill, well, not physically, anyway. 242 00:18:53,660 --> 00:18:55,730 He, erm, took his own life. 243 00:18:58,060 --> 00:19:01,530 I'm sorry to hear that. Do you mind if I ask how? 244 00:19:03,420 --> 00:19:06,218 He hanged himself. Highgate Woods. 245 00:19:06,940 --> 00:19:10,455 So did he have a history of depression or mental illness? 246 00:19:12,660 --> 00:19:13,979 What are you suggesting? 247 00:19:14,060 --> 00:19:16,210 Did he? 248 00:19:17,900 --> 00:19:18,969 No. 249 00:19:21,940 --> 00:19:23,055 Right. 250 00:19:25,260 --> 00:19:26,818 Do you know if your mum's at home? 251 00:19:35,300 --> 00:19:36,369 Paxton? 252 00:19:37,020 --> 00:19:40,899 Don't recall a Len Paxton, before my time probably. 253 00:19:41,860 --> 00:19:42,929 Really? 254 00:19:44,420 --> 00:19:45,455 Sorry? 255 00:19:45,540 --> 00:19:47,132 Well, no, it's just, erm... 256 00:19:47,620 --> 00:19:51,135 Well, I found him with a simple Google search, so. 257 00:19:52,740 --> 00:19:54,173 What you asking me about him for then? 258 00:19:55,900 --> 00:19:59,939 Because I wanna know what happened to him after he left prison in 1988. 259 00:20:00,020 --> 00:20:02,853 For assaulting two boys from a platoon in Dumfries. 260 00:20:03,740 --> 00:20:07,289 Look, this is all ancient history. 261 00:20:08,740 --> 00:20:11,413 Do you know what? I, I am getting 262 00:20:11,500 --> 00:20:14,412 really pissed off with that expression because it's just not. 263 00:20:15,260 --> 00:20:17,216 The sort of things people like Len Paxton did, 264 00:20:17,300 --> 00:20:18,733 they're still affecting people today. 265 00:20:18,820 --> 00:20:20,572 Catastrophically. It 266 00:20:21,700 --> 00:20:24,851 fucks up whole lives. Okay? 267 00:20:25,820 --> 00:20:29,654 So, unless you want me to come back tonight when all the parents are here, 268 00:20:30,420 --> 00:20:33,298 I'd start trying a little harder to remember, if I were you. 269 00:20:36,940 --> 00:20:38,009 He's dead. 270 00:20:41,860 --> 00:20:42,929 When? 271 00:20:44,460 --> 00:20:45,575 '92. 272 00:20:48,140 --> 00:20:49,289 How? 273 00:20:49,940 --> 00:20:51,931 He topped himself, everyone reckoned. 274 00:20:54,420 --> 00:20:55,535 "Reckoned"? 275 00:20:55,620 --> 00:20:58,817 He had this little yacht, he used to take some of the lads out on. 276 00:20:59,580 --> 00:21:01,855 It was found a few days after he went missing, 277 00:21:01,940 --> 00:21:04,135 drifting in open water off Greenock Harbour. 278 00:21:05,180 --> 00:21:06,693 They never found his body. 279 00:21:07,580 --> 00:21:10,890 Although, I'm not sure anyone looked too hard. 280 00:21:17,620 --> 00:21:19,850 It's changed. We've changed. 281 00:21:21,220 --> 00:21:23,654 People like him don't slip through the nets anymore. 282 00:21:23,740 --> 00:21:25,378 Well, I really hope so. 283 00:21:26,300 --> 00:21:30,054 But they were saying that 30 years ago. And 20. And 10. 284 00:21:30,140 --> 00:21:32,256 And I just pray 285 00:21:32,340 --> 00:21:35,571 that they won't be saying it 20 years from now, about today. 286 00:21:46,180 --> 00:21:47,772 Her father told me what he'd found out 287 00:21:47,860 --> 00:21:49,373 in the months after she ran away. 288 00:21:49,580 --> 00:21:51,935 This was while she was still 13? 289 00:21:53,220 --> 00:21:56,053 And being taken to parties organised by men like Walker, 290 00:21:57,020 --> 00:21:58,169 and raped. 291 00:21:58,580 --> 00:22:02,971 Did he not report this? Did he not go to the police? 292 00:22:03,500 --> 00:22:04,615 Yes. 293 00:22:05,980 --> 00:22:07,936 And, apparently, your lot told him you couldn't do anything, 294 00:22:08,020 --> 00:22:11,490 because it'd been her choice to become a child prostitute. 295 00:22:11,580 --> 00:22:14,731 A phrase it should be fucking illegal to even use. 296 00:22:25,060 --> 00:22:26,254 Oh, Jesus. 297 00:22:29,340 --> 00:22:31,137 - You knew. - No. 298 00:22:32,060 --> 00:22:35,018 She told you. You knew. 299 00:22:35,100 --> 00:22:36,818 I did not know. 300 00:22:38,940 --> 00:22:41,329 She was always making things up, Elise. 301 00:22:41,660 --> 00:22:43,696 Exaggerating everything. 302 00:22:44,780 --> 00:22:46,975 Your father would never have done the things that she said. 303 00:22:47,060 --> 00:22:49,051 How old was she when she told you? 304 00:22:50,740 --> 00:22:53,300 You tell me now or I swear I'll... 305 00:22:53,420 --> 00:22:54,569 Elise. 306 00:22:58,940 --> 00:23:00,134 12. 307 00:23:00,940 --> 00:23:02,214 My... 308 00:23:07,740 --> 00:23:11,619 And you decided not to believe her because... What? 309 00:23:12,460 --> 00:23:16,738 You didn't wanna lose the house? Or the research trips abroad? 310 00:23:16,820 --> 00:23:17,969 Or because... What? 311 00:23:18,740 --> 00:23:21,129 You're an evil fucking witch! 312 00:23:26,460 --> 00:23:31,250 And we have wondered all our lives why she is so angry? 313 00:23:49,100 --> 00:23:53,890 I need you to tell me exactly what Marion told you. 314 00:23:55,620 --> 00:23:56,814 Please. 315 00:24:00,540 --> 00:24:03,577 - What sort of a mother does that? - I'm struggling to be charitable. 316 00:24:03,660 --> 00:24:05,969 Well, Osborne's dad clearly had no idea. 317 00:24:06,060 --> 00:24:07,493 Yeah, nor did Marion's sister. 318 00:24:07,580 --> 00:24:09,571 I guess we've lost our element of surprise. 319 00:24:09,660 --> 00:24:10,979 I'm pretty sure all three of them will know 320 00:24:11,060 --> 00:24:12,175 the questions we've been asking now. 321 00:24:12,260 --> 00:24:15,013 Which is why I want to get in front of Colin and Marion today 322 00:24:15,100 --> 00:24:16,499 while they're still on the back foot. 323 00:24:16,700 --> 00:24:17,769 And ask them what? 324 00:24:17,860 --> 00:24:19,418 Where they were when their own abusers died. 325 00:24:19,500 --> 00:24:23,095 Because if we're right, they'll have absolutely watertight alibis. 326 00:24:23,180 --> 00:24:27,093 Which both proves the theory, and sort of screws us, evidentially. 327 00:24:28,420 --> 00:24:29,819 What have we got from Murray? 328 00:24:30,420 --> 00:24:34,254 So, he's spent all day trawling NHS records. 329 00:24:34,340 --> 00:24:39,130 Turns out that at various points in '87 and early 1988, 330 00:24:39,460 --> 00:24:43,692 both Colin and Sara were under the care of Ealing Hospital psychiatric unit. 331 00:24:45,620 --> 00:24:47,338 - As in-patients? - Yeah. 332 00:24:47,420 --> 00:24:48,535 What about Marion? 333 00:24:48,620 --> 00:24:51,418 We haven't located her records yet, but here's a thing, 334 00:24:51,500 --> 00:24:53,889 before she lived at her Smoke Lane flat, 335 00:24:53,980 --> 00:24:56,574 from early '86 to late '87, 336 00:24:57,380 --> 00:24:59,257 she lived in a flat in South Ealing. 337 00:25:02,300 --> 00:25:05,736 So that's the link, they met in Ealing Psychiatric Unit. 338 00:25:06,700 --> 00:25:08,691 Well, this could be hard to prove, 339 00:25:08,780 --> 00:25:10,577 but, yeah, it's gotta be a possibility, isn't it? 340 00:25:13,940 --> 00:25:15,055 Yeah. 341 00:25:16,740 --> 00:25:19,698 You track down Colin. I'll speak to Marion. Thanks, Sunny. 342 00:25:22,860 --> 00:25:25,090 The train now approaching platform four 343 00:25:25,180 --> 00:25:26,329 does not stop here. 344 00:25:26,420 --> 00:25:29,253 Stand back from the edge of platform four. 345 00:25:29,380 --> 00:25:31,848 The next train is not scheduled to stop. 346 00:25:41,780 --> 00:25:42,929 Jason? 347 00:25:45,460 --> 00:25:46,779 How are you doing? 348 00:25:49,900 --> 00:25:51,094 Fancy a cuppa? 349 00:25:52,700 --> 00:25:53,769 Yes. 350 00:26:17,260 --> 00:26:19,899 Look, I know it's really annoying 351 00:26:19,980 --> 00:26:22,574 when people give you trite bits of advice on how to be happy, 352 00:26:22,660 --> 00:26:26,619 but you don't have to be defined by your past. 353 00:26:26,980 --> 00:26:29,813 I had a horrible relationship split a couple of years ago. 354 00:26:29,900 --> 00:26:32,778 Then my mum died. And then my cat. 355 00:26:34,180 --> 00:26:37,490 And I was really struggling. And then I met this bloke. 356 00:26:38,620 --> 00:26:42,898 I thought, "God, he's nice, he's not like other blokes, 357 00:26:43,580 --> 00:26:45,775 "I'd love to get to know him better." 358 00:26:46,420 --> 00:26:49,969 And it showed me that there was possibility. Ahead. 359 00:26:50,780 --> 00:26:52,532 - Do you see? - Yeah. 360 00:26:54,020 --> 00:26:55,499 That life goes on, Jase. 361 00:26:58,380 --> 00:27:01,770 Right. Yeah, well, thanks for that. And good luck with the bloke. 362 00:27:02,620 --> 00:27:04,850 No, Jase, the bloke's you. 363 00:27:07,340 --> 00:27:09,615 - You what? - It's you. 364 00:27:11,220 --> 00:27:12,369 I like you. 365 00:27:13,980 --> 00:27:16,892 - Really? - Don't look so surprised. 366 00:27:17,540 --> 00:27:18,893 It's just, erm... 367 00:27:20,580 --> 00:27:22,536 No one's ever said that to me. 368 00:27:23,060 --> 00:27:27,531 So what I wanted to say was, shall we get that date in the diary? 369 00:27:36,580 --> 00:27:40,255 - Marion, please. Don't go out now. - I am fine. Honestly. 370 00:27:40,500 --> 00:27:42,252 Please don't say anything to Tony just yet, 371 00:27:42,340 --> 00:27:44,058 'cause I need to speak to him myself, okay? 372 00:27:44,700 --> 00:27:48,010 - I'll be back in a couple of hours. - I love you. 373 00:27:48,900 --> 00:27:52,609 - I love you, too. - And I am so, so, sorry. 374 00:28:21,740 --> 00:28:24,174 - Sunny. - Guv, Colin's not at his house. 375 00:28:24,540 --> 00:28:27,213 His husband said he'd moved out for a bit and was staying at a Holiday Inn, 376 00:28:27,300 --> 00:28:28,733 but he's not there either. 377 00:28:29,220 --> 00:28:31,131 - Right. - You at Marion's yet? 378 00:28:32,340 --> 00:28:34,535 Er, no, no. Not, not yet. 379 00:28:36,340 --> 00:28:37,489 I'll call you. 380 00:29:48,100 --> 00:29:51,456 They have no proof of anything, Marion, and they never will have. 381 00:29:51,740 --> 00:29:52,889 But they know. 382 00:29:53,260 --> 00:29:55,376 But knowing something and proving it in a court of law 383 00:29:55,460 --> 00:29:56,973 are two very different things. 384 00:30:02,500 --> 00:30:03,819 Yeah, they are. 385 00:30:05,940 --> 00:30:07,089 Very different. 386 00:30:18,020 --> 00:30:19,214 Marion. 387 00:30:19,740 --> 00:30:22,015 Where are you running to? It's over. 388 00:30:22,100 --> 00:30:24,409 So, I want to speak to my husband now. Okay? 389 00:30:24,500 --> 00:30:26,138 Now I want to explain. 390 00:30:32,740 --> 00:30:35,857 Well, I was in Goa when Paxton went missing. 391 00:30:35,940 --> 00:30:39,091 Er, I have hotel and flights receipts. I can prove I wasn't here. 392 00:30:39,180 --> 00:30:40,408 I'm sure. 393 00:30:40,620 --> 00:30:43,578 And when Marion's father died? 394 00:30:43,940 --> 00:30:46,408 Can you prove you weren't in Highgate Woods? 395 00:30:48,380 --> 00:30:52,214 And did you meet them both in Ealing Psychiatric Unit, 396 00:30:53,980 --> 00:30:55,299 or just Sara? 397 00:31:05,020 --> 00:31:09,650 I've read, er, people who've been abused 398 00:31:09,940 --> 00:31:11,896 can always recognise other victims. 399 00:31:13,300 --> 00:31:15,609 Something in the way they carry themselves. 400 00:31:16,660 --> 00:31:17,775 Was it that? 401 00:31:19,700 --> 00:31:22,260 That drew you to each other? 402 00:31:26,500 --> 00:31:31,290 So I guess now you pull what you have together, 403 00:31:32,660 --> 00:31:36,573 and present it to the CPS 404 00:31:38,020 --> 00:31:41,456 and they may go for it and you may be able to charge us. 405 00:31:44,500 --> 00:31:47,697 But before you do, maybe I could just give you some other facts? 406 00:31:47,780 --> 00:31:49,008 Please do. 407 00:31:51,740 --> 00:31:52,968 So... 408 00:31:55,500 --> 00:31:59,652 He used to come 'round to our house on Sunday nights, 409 00:32:00,780 --> 00:32:02,213 mainly, for a roast dinner. 410 00:32:03,780 --> 00:32:06,658 And he'd always find time to play with me. 411 00:32:07,260 --> 00:32:10,889 He'd pretend to be a horse and I'd climb on his back 412 00:32:10,980 --> 00:32:12,811 and then he'd buck and twist and turn, 413 00:32:12,900 --> 00:32:17,291 and I was a cowboy at a bucking bronco contest and I fucking loved him. 414 00:32:18,260 --> 00:32:23,778 And when my dad found out that he ran the local Club Rangers Platoon 415 00:32:24,020 --> 00:32:27,296 and suggested that I join, I could not have been happier. 416 00:32:28,340 --> 00:32:30,808 And for six months it was the best time of my life. 417 00:32:31,460 --> 00:32:33,735 We played football and kick the can 418 00:32:33,820 --> 00:32:37,529 and made fires in the woods and bows and arrows, it was 419 00:32:38,420 --> 00:32:40,138 Enid Blyton for real. 420 00:32:43,580 --> 00:32:46,731 The first time it happened was when we went camping for the weekend. 421 00:32:47,460 --> 00:32:51,214 My tent was an old army one of my granddad's 422 00:32:51,780 --> 00:32:53,657 and when we started to put it up, 423 00:32:54,020 --> 00:32:57,376 he said it wouldn't be any good because it wasn't waterproof anymore 424 00:32:58,020 --> 00:32:59,419 and it was gonna rain. 425 00:33:00,100 --> 00:33:03,410 But that was okay he said, because he had room in his tent. 426 00:33:04,940 --> 00:33:10,219 That night he only gave me a massage to help with the day's hike. 427 00:33:11,940 --> 00:33:16,172 Er, the next night he touched me and asked me to touch him. 428 00:33:17,540 --> 00:33:19,212 It didn't rain that night, either. 429 00:33:21,980 --> 00:33:26,178 I can spend a lifetime talking to you about the shame 430 00:33:28,060 --> 00:33:29,254 and guilt. 431 00:33:30,540 --> 00:33:33,213 And how I thought I must have actually wanted him 432 00:33:33,300 --> 00:33:35,689 to do it because sometimes I got an erection. 433 00:33:37,340 --> 00:33:40,696 And how I couldn't tell Mum and Dad because he was their friend 434 00:33:40,780 --> 00:33:43,852 and I didn't want to upset them or embarrass anyone. 435 00:33:44,620 --> 00:33:45,814 And how I couldn't tell anyone else 436 00:33:45,900 --> 00:33:48,050 because he said I'd be sent away if I did. 437 00:33:51,420 --> 00:33:54,059 But I do still ask myself, every single day, 438 00:33:55,180 --> 00:33:56,613 why didn't I tell someone? 439 00:34:01,900 --> 00:34:03,572 Then over the next 440 00:34:05,340 --> 00:34:06,739 six months, 441 00:34:07,660 --> 00:34:10,732 on visits to our house when my parents were out, 442 00:34:12,580 --> 00:34:14,491 he did... He did things 443 00:34:19,420 --> 00:34:21,888 which actually physically damaged me for life. 444 00:34:24,860 --> 00:34:28,614 Because a 48-year-old man is not meant to put himself inside a 9-year-old boy. 445 00:34:32,180 --> 00:34:37,334 But much worse than the physical damage is the damage he did to me as a person. 446 00:34:38,820 --> 00:34:43,052 Because that first time, he changed me, instantly and forever. 447 00:34:44,660 --> 00:34:47,970 The drinking, the rage, 448 00:34:48,300 --> 00:34:52,259 the suicide attempts, the fighting, the manic working. 449 00:34:54,780 --> 00:34:58,853 The endless exhausting visceral rage 450 00:34:59,060 --> 00:35:01,096 that I feel every day of my life, 451 00:35:01,180 --> 00:35:04,058 that I feel right at this moment, having to explain this to you. 452 00:35:06,460 --> 00:35:08,371 That is all because of him. 453 00:35:13,980 --> 00:35:18,098 So you might put me in prison. But let me tell you this, 454 00:35:18,580 --> 00:35:22,892 you can't judge me unless you've had it done to you. 455 00:35:25,380 --> 00:35:30,215 I won't ever, ever, let any one judge me for what I did. 456 00:35:43,900 --> 00:35:48,690 And just so you know, what happened to Sara and Marion, 457 00:35:49,780 --> 00:35:51,133 was much worse. 458 00:36:21,180 --> 00:36:23,774 Hiya. You okay? 459 00:36:31,500 --> 00:36:33,013 I need to tell you something. 460 00:36:51,140 --> 00:36:55,258 For a while I wondered if he only took the job in Cork because of the house. 461 00:36:56,140 --> 00:36:59,018 Which meant that Elise and I had our own rooms, finally. 462 00:37:01,700 --> 00:37:04,976 First time, my mum was just downstairs, 463 00:37:06,220 --> 00:37:07,938 she was watching The Onedin Line. 464 00:37:08,940 --> 00:37:10,578 I could hear the theme music. 465 00:37:12,620 --> 00:37:16,499 And he came in when my lights were out and he knelt by my bedside. 466 00:37:16,860 --> 00:37:20,091 And he said that I was growing up now, 467 00:37:21,380 --> 00:37:25,009 becoming a young woman, and that soon I'd have boyfriends. 468 00:37:26,340 --> 00:37:28,535 And he wanted me to be prepared for that. 469 00:37:29,380 --> 00:37:30,654 He wanted to help me 470 00:37:31,860 --> 00:37:33,612 so I knew how to enjoy it. 471 00:37:36,700 --> 00:37:39,373 And then he put his hand under the covers 472 00:37:41,660 --> 00:37:43,491 and he did what a boyfriend might do. 473 00:37:44,780 --> 00:37:48,614 And he did that pretty much every Saturday night 474 00:37:48,700 --> 00:37:50,577 when he was home, for about a year? 475 00:37:52,860 --> 00:37:55,897 And then one day, when I was having my tea, 476 00:37:57,060 --> 00:37:58,459 I finally told my mum 477 00:37:59,700 --> 00:38:02,772 that he did things to me while she was downstairs. 478 00:38:03,460 --> 00:38:07,339 And I remember she was... She was peeling potatoes at the sink. 479 00:38:08,580 --> 00:38:09,808 And she never even stopped. 480 00:38:09,900 --> 00:38:13,176 She never turned to me, she never said anything. 481 00:38:13,260 --> 00:38:15,569 And five minutes later, 482 00:38:15,660 --> 00:38:18,970 she told me to go back upstairs and finish my homework. 483 00:38:20,460 --> 00:38:23,020 And I wondered, at first, if she hadn't been listening. 484 00:38:23,100 --> 00:38:27,491 But then, that night, she came upstairs and stayed there, 485 00:38:27,940 --> 00:38:30,170 folding clothes and, and tidying 486 00:38:31,300 --> 00:38:33,177 for an hour after I went to bed. 487 00:38:34,820 --> 00:38:38,210 And, of course, he never came near me. 488 00:38:39,420 --> 00:38:42,730 And she did that for about six months, and then one day she just stopped. 489 00:38:45,020 --> 00:38:49,616 And then when she and my sister were out at the cinema, 490 00:38:49,700 --> 00:38:51,053 a few weeks later, 491 00:38:52,740 --> 00:38:54,253 he raped me for the first time. 492 00:38:56,220 --> 00:38:58,370 And I remember I said to him, erm... 493 00:39:00,580 --> 00:39:03,890 If he did the same to Elise and he said no, no, it just me, 494 00:39:04,260 --> 00:39:05,488 because I was special. 495 00:39:09,260 --> 00:39:10,659 I was special. 496 00:39:15,020 --> 00:39:16,612 And the anger, Tony, the anger 497 00:39:16,700 --> 00:39:19,373 that I felt for so many years and I still do... 498 00:39:25,180 --> 00:39:27,250 In the end, it made me do a terrible thing. 499 00:39:51,820 --> 00:39:52,969 Hey. 500 00:39:54,860 --> 00:39:56,009 Hiya. 501 00:39:59,460 --> 00:40:00,654 How are you? 502 00:40:01,940 --> 00:40:03,134 He sent me that. 503 00:40:05,220 --> 00:40:06,369 Who did? 504 00:40:06,700 --> 00:40:08,975 Him. Your mother's lover. 505 00:40:09,380 --> 00:40:12,770 It's the letter she wrote telling him why she was finishing with him. 506 00:40:14,180 --> 00:40:18,139 How she realised that what we had was what she wanted. 507 00:40:19,540 --> 00:40:22,054 How terrible she felt about what she'd done, 508 00:40:24,260 --> 00:40:27,696 and how the affair made her realise 509 00:40:28,460 --> 00:40:30,018 how much she loved me. 510 00:40:32,900 --> 00:40:34,333 It's a good letter. 511 00:40:35,780 --> 00:40:37,736 To read, Cass. For me. 512 00:40:39,460 --> 00:40:41,610 It's very good for me to know that. 513 00:40:42,940 --> 00:40:44,055 Mmm. 514 00:40:54,580 --> 00:40:58,095 And you wouldn't have got it if you hadn't have gone to see him, Dad. 515 00:41:03,980 --> 00:41:06,540 - So you know, you were right. - You. 516 00:41:19,140 --> 00:41:20,778 Oh... 517 00:41:21,340 --> 00:41:24,218 Listen, I've gotta make a quick call. 518 00:41:25,980 --> 00:41:27,333 I love you, Dad. 519 00:41:28,340 --> 00:41:29,534 Just, er... 520 00:41:30,860 --> 00:41:32,179 I'll be quick. 521 00:41:48,660 --> 00:41:50,616 - Sunny? - Hey. 522 00:41:52,660 --> 00:41:53,854 Can you meet me? 523 00:41:57,860 --> 00:41:59,930 This case rests or falls on them knowing each other. 524 00:42:00,020 --> 00:42:02,580 Without conclusive proof of that, it is just a theory. 525 00:42:02,660 --> 00:42:03,854 And they're not gonna confess. 526 00:42:04,580 --> 00:42:07,777 And without any bodies, it's gonna be very hard 527 00:42:07,860 --> 00:42:09,532 to connect any of them to the deaths. 528 00:42:11,660 --> 00:42:14,618 So I can't see the CPS being delirious to press charges. 529 00:42:14,700 --> 00:42:16,213 But we do have proof now. 530 00:42:17,860 --> 00:42:20,215 You've just told me you saw them together. 531 00:42:20,300 --> 00:42:21,415 I saw them. 532 00:42:23,940 --> 00:42:25,214 On my own. 533 00:42:26,660 --> 00:42:28,059 CCTV? Or... 534 00:42:29,980 --> 00:42:31,652 And they arrived separately. 535 00:42:34,180 --> 00:42:35,249 Fuck. 536 00:42:35,860 --> 00:42:37,612 Yeah. Fuck. 537 00:42:42,620 --> 00:42:43,814 Well... 538 00:42:46,100 --> 00:42:49,217 I guess, in the end, you have to ask yourself the old question. 539 00:42:50,460 --> 00:42:52,098 Why do we send people to prison? 540 00:42:54,300 --> 00:42:56,894 And do Colin, Sara and Marion... 541 00:43:00,820 --> 00:43:03,459 ...need to be deterred from committing murder again? 542 00:43:03,780 --> 00:43:06,817 - No. - No. I don't think so. 543 00:43:09,100 --> 00:43:13,059 So, do they need to be rehabilitated? 544 00:43:13,340 --> 00:43:15,695 I mean, for the last 20 years, at least, 545 00:43:16,140 --> 00:43:19,689 I mean, they've all been very valuable members of society. 546 00:43:19,940 --> 00:43:23,376 All three of them. I mean, helping the most vulnerable. 547 00:43:26,460 --> 00:43:27,893 Which means, 548 00:43:30,060 --> 00:43:32,528 in the end, it pretty much comes down to punishment. 549 00:43:34,260 --> 00:43:36,569 Do Colin, Sara and Marion need to be punished? 550 00:43:36,660 --> 00:43:40,255 And that's it, you see. Because for me, 551 00:43:41,380 --> 00:43:46,215 I think their whole lives have been one, long, indescribably brutal punishment. 552 00:43:47,140 --> 00:43:50,177 And I just can't see why we would punish them further. 553 00:43:53,220 --> 00:43:54,414 I can't see who would benefit. 554 00:43:57,300 --> 00:43:59,609 No. No. Nor can I. 555 00:44:00,500 --> 00:44:01,694 Okay. 556 00:44:03,100 --> 00:44:04,249 So... 557 00:44:06,660 --> 00:44:07,809 This is 558 00:44:09,540 --> 00:44:13,533 significant, Sunny. This is a pretty fucking huge thing I would do here. 559 00:44:13,620 --> 00:44:15,895 - Yeah? You? - Mmm, yeah. 560 00:44:16,060 --> 00:44:18,255 To be absolutely clear, this is just me. 561 00:44:18,340 --> 00:44:20,808 You would never be implicated in any decision I make. 562 00:44:20,900 --> 00:44:24,097 But if you have a single shred of doubt, please, you tell me now. 563 00:44:24,180 --> 00:44:26,648 Tell me to go to Andrews first thing tomorrow morning, 564 00:44:26,740 --> 00:44:29,493 report everything, tell him I saw them all, together. 565 00:44:43,620 --> 00:44:45,690 I don't believe they could be charged, 566 00:44:47,780 --> 00:44:52,729 and I see no point in disrupting their lives further. So, no. 567 00:44:53,620 --> 00:44:56,373 I won't tell you to do that. 568 00:45:05,500 --> 00:45:07,968 You're all right, do you know that? 569 00:45:09,940 --> 00:45:11,373 You're not so bad yourself. 570 00:45:16,300 --> 00:45:18,655 I'm gonna leave now, before you try and snog me. 571 00:45:18,940 --> 00:45:20,339 Smart move. 572 00:45:32,980 --> 00:45:34,095 Night-night, Sunny. 573 00:45:35,180 --> 00:45:36,295 Night, Guv. 574 00:01:50,500 --> 00:01:54,500